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Le God
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« Reply #2325 on: 29 July 2010, 04:55 PM » |
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He'll never justify his fee. Elmander, in the right system, could be useful; but he'll never be a 10mil (or 8 or 9 or whatever we paid) player. He either needs to play the right role, or he needs to go. I get the feeling neither will happen.
8.2 million... right from the mouth of Gary Megsons. |
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azreal88
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« Reply #2326 on: 29 July 2010, 04:55 PM » |
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I didnt mean justify his fee, I meant that hopefully he will look like a 8 million pound forward this season rather than the 1 million pound forward he has looked thus far.
That's what I'm saying. We paid that much for him, but he's not that good. He will never look an 8mil player because he isn't one. Even when flying for Toulouse I'd have rated him at 5mil tops. |
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azreal88
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« Reply #2327 on: 29 July 2010, 04:56 PM » |
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8.2 million... right from the mouth of Gary Megsons.
Ridiculous amount. Especially as he'd clearly never watched him play. |
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Keegan
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« Reply #2328 on: 29 July 2010, 04:57 PM » |
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Yes, he is. 75 Prem games, 12 goals. Simple.
For future reference, what strike rate qualifies a striker to be good? |
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"I will love the light for it shows me the way, yet I will endure the darkness because it shows me the stars.”
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Big_Sharps
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« Reply #2329 on: 29 July 2010, 04:58 PM » |
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1 in 4 at least to be "good"
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Jamster26
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« Reply #2330 on: 29 July 2010, 05:05 PM » |
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From a striker, yes. The trouble is that Elmander isn't one. Toulouse put him up top but gave him full license and he roamed and did his thing. It's just that Megson saw a big lad and assumed he was a centre-forward and therefore that's how he's being used. I said to Jimbo when we signed him that we'd be lucky to get 8 or so out of him and he'd bomb if we used him as a striker and I'm sticking with that. The trouble is that Davo is understandably first choice and therefore Elmo can't play his proper role in a 4-4-2 or we'd have no runner.
8 goals is a good return from Johan Elmander. Used properly he is also capable of a few assists and linking play, but we'll probably play him as a full-on forward again and he'll do very little. To be honest I'll be surprised if his confidence isn't so shot that he can't even perform if given a free-hand.
Where do you think he should play then Az; just off the front man, eg Davies? |
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"Just when they think they have all the answers, I change the questions".
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azreal88
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« Reply #2331 on: 29 July 2010, 05:17 PM » |
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Where do you think he should play then Az; just off the front man, eg Davies?
Depends on the other players. I don't think he can play with Davies in any form of effective partnership. Elmander does have enough about him to play the "foil" to Davies and Davies has dreadful movement so he can't get on the end of balls from Elmander from deep. At Toulouse Elmander was nominally a lone striker, but what actually happened was he dropped off or ran channels and the midfield runners got beyond him a lot and allowed hi to link play from the back to the wings or attacking mid. Toulouse had some pace from midfield to augment Elmander and he was always well supported, even though they had some awful players. If we had to play him with Davies I'd go 4-2-3-1 and use him in the hole but I just don't think it would work. |
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azreal88
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« Reply #2332 on: 29 July 2010, 05:21 PM » |
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For future reference, what strike rate qualifies a striker to be good?
Depends what else they do in the game. 1 in 3 if all they do is shoot. Could be less if they create goals for others or have something else that sets them apart. King can't pass, doesn't create anything and is generally useless. He's a forward with 3 assists in nearly 80 games, which says all it needs to about his all-round play. |
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Chris Rabz
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« Reply #2333 on: 29 July 2010, 06:12 PM » |
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The difference is on his day Diouf was world class, Marlon on the other hand...... So while they are both scumbags, only one of them is/was good.
That's my point, that the fans don't really care about a player's previous problems off the pitch so long as they deliver on it. If they become a fans favourite like Diouf was, they can do no wrong. If they are seen to be a poor player, then their off-pitch antics is just another reason to dislike them. |
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When routine bites hard, and ambitions are low. When resentment rides high, but emotion won't grow... And we're changing our ways, taking different roads. Love... Love will tear us apart, again.
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traf
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« Reply #2334 on: 29 July 2010, 06:18 PM » |
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Diouf was/is an over-rated cock.
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Everybody is a genius. But, if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will spend its whole life believing that it is stupid
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Keegan
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« Reply #2335 on: 29 July 2010, 07:52 PM » |
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Depends what else they do in the game. 1 in 3 if all they do is shoot. Could be less if they create goals for others or have something else that sets them apart. Duly noted. I could get into the whole "Stats aren't everything" debate, but I can't be bothered. |
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azreal88
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« Reply #2336 on: 29 July 2010, 08:18 PM » |
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Duly noted. I could get into the whole "Stats aren't everything" debate, but I can't be bothered.
Stats are not everything, but not scoring goals means he is not what we need. I also think he's a poor player. |
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Martinbwfc
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« Reply #2337 on: 30 July 2010, 12:24 AM » |
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8.2 million... right from the mouth of Gary Megsons.
And of course he would'nt dream of telling an untruth to try and justify his inadequadices. |
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« Last Edit: 30 July 2010, 03:46 AM by Martinbwfc »
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You never get a second chance to make a first impression, so just give the twat a good shoeing, he'll respect you.
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bigsamsarmyusa
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« Reply #2338 on: 30 July 2010, 04:59 AM » |
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I read that Orr has left Bristol City, so that now frees them to complete the Hunt signing; maybe Friday?
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pfk
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« Reply #2339 on: 30 July 2010, 05:28 AM » |
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Diouf was/is an over-rated cock.
Nonsense.. some of the things he does on the pitch are absolutely top drawer, his only problem is his lack of consistency. Still, I can remember when he was still in our team he was getting a ton of flack from the likes of Taylor, who is now everyone's favorite punching bag. Diouf would often go missing but with the ball at his feet he always wanted to run at players, "win" free kicks and be generally positive. I miss having him in our side, winding up the opposition and their fans, he was one of a kind. Would have him back in a heartbeat. |
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Jebus
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« Reply #2340 on: 30 July 2010, 10:50 AM » |
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I'm at the point where I'm questioning Elmander's worth. I'm not sure what he brings to the squad and I don't think he's ever going to get much better. I don't know what formation he needs to play in, but whatever, he can't play with Davies, that's for sure. 4-4-2 doesnt suit him, 4-3-3 doesn't suit him, 4-5-1 doesn't suit him...I dunno...
If we could get 4-6 million for him I think I'd happily take it and use that money to bring in Klasnic, Moreno (if that is still possible) and probably Nugent as well. If we could somehow manage that I think we'd be ready. Bringing Wilshere back would be nice, but I don't think it'll happen and I'd be happier if we had decent right footed cover for Lee, but otherwise I feel the squad is strong enough to do far better than we have done.
On the Diouf subject, never liked him and thought he was over-rated. I feel maybe Sam coached some of the "skill" out of him, he ended up running into the corner and forever trying to win free-kicks, corners and throw-ins. I could never bring myself to cheer his name either.
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« Last Edit: 30 July 2010, 10:52 AM by Jebus »
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aarons2009
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« Reply #2341 on: 30 July 2010, 11:07 AM » |
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We're the one and only Wanderers!
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DaveBWFC
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« Reply #2342 on: 30 July 2010, 11:08 AM » |
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4-6 million for Elmander? Dream on mate.
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Jamster26
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« Reply #2343 on: 30 July 2010, 11:26 AM » |
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"Just when they think they have all the answers, I change the questions".
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Jebus
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« Reply #2344 on: 30 July 2010, 11:28 AM » |
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4-6 million for Elmander? Dream on mate.
I reckon we could probably get 4.5 for him to be honest... |
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Jamster26
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« Reply #2345 on: 30 July 2010, 11:30 AM » |
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Do you think Toulose would take him back?
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"Just when they think they have all the answers, I change the questions".
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Jebus
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« Reply #2346 on: 30 July 2010, 11:36 AM » |
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Probably for 4 million yeah!
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Jamster26
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« Reply #2347 on: 30 July 2010, 11:38 AM » |
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That's the best chance we are going to get at flogging him as no English team will touch him with a barge pole!
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"Just when they think they have all the answers, I change the questions".
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Le God
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« Reply #2348 on: 30 July 2010, 05:42 PM » |
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aarons2009
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« Reply #2349 on: 30 July 2010, 08:17 PM » |
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Still wouldn't suprise me if Arsenal tried and buy Cahill and for around £15mill and put Wilshere in on the deal.
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We're the one and only Wanderers!
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